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OPRAH: 2033 ? by: MarLee [The following is a transcript of the Oprah Winfrey program from September 19, 2033] Announcer: Welcome to our studio in Chicago for the Oprah Winfrey show, as America's premiere talk show host celebrates her 48th year on the air. Here is your host, Oprah Winfrey! [Audience applause]. Oprah: Hello everybody we have a very special show today. As you know, the nation has been torn asunder in the last 25 years by the controversial drug treatments developed by WalkerChem Laboratories. On yesterday's show our guests were opponents of the WalkerChem drugs and their adoption in the US. The Reverand Jerald Falwell Jr. of Lynchburg, 134 year old Republican Senator Strom Thurmond, and Joseph Daniels of the National Organization for Men all gave their most cogent arguments against the so-called "Walker Treatment". Today we will hear the other side. I'm sure you all understand how important this issue is. Thirty-two states have mandated the use of the WalkerChem products by all teenagers as they hit puberty. Four other states have made use optional but encouraged. The other states of the union, mostly in the South but with a few in the West, have resisted the Treatment and most of them have in fact outlawed it. The fierce disagreement between the two sides has our nation as close to Civil War as we have been for over 168 years. Some Southern legislatures are beginning to openly speak of seccession. It is in this atmosphere that I felt my show, being the highest rated daytime show on television for the 46h consecutive year, could be used to promote understanding and empathy on BOTH sides. Yesterday I allowed opponents of the WalkerChem Treatment to state their argument. Today we'll hear the other side. I'm gearing this show especially to my fans in states such as Utah, Tennessee, Mississippi, and Idaho where the WalkerChem Treatments are illegal. A lot of misinformation has been spread in those states, but I promise that today's show will contain nothing but the truth. Those of you who have been living in 'Walker' states for some time will perhaps find some of what we cover early in the show to be redundant, and obvious common knowledge. But there are people in various parts of the country who have never even met a 'Walkerized' person and who have perhaps heard all kinds of lies and distortions about what life is like in places like New York, Los Angeles, or Chicago today. Please bear with us. I also want to caution the studio audience today, just as I did yesterday, as we deal with this difficult and sensitive issue: I have made sure that our studio audience has in it people from both sides of this Great Divide that our nation is dealing with. I want everyone's voice to be heard. But that can lead to a volatile situation, because emotions run so high. Please remember that we are here to have an intelligent discourse and do not resort to violence. With that said, I'd like to introduce our first guest, Dr. Stephanie Haywood, a senior biochemist from WalkerChem, Inc. [Dr. Haywood, a tall African-American woman in her mid 40s, with, wearing a gray pantsuit, enters and shakes hands with our aging host. There is a good deal of applause from the audience but also some boos]. Oprah: Welcome to the Oprah Show. Dr. Haywood: Thank you Oprah. Oprah: Dr. Haywood, could you please give our audience a brief history of the development of the two primary WalkerChem drugs, Hertozine and Histromycin. Please remember that some members of our audience from isolated parts of the country have never come in contact with these drugs, and perhaps never even met someone who has taken them. Dr. Haywood: Yes, Oprah. The story begins in the early part of the 21st Century. Dr. Ashley Walker was a young biochemist with one of the large pharmaceutical companies. She headed a research lab, and was given quite a bit of autonomy to do any type of research she felt might result in a profitable product for the company. One of Dr. Walker's projects was an attempt to come up with a reliable birth control pill that a woman could take one time, and be free of the risk of pregnancy until a time of her choosing, when she would then take a 'reversal' drug which would then enable her to conceive. If such a pill could be created, the necessity of taking daily birth control pills to remain safe from the risk of pregnancy would disappear forever. Teenage girls could take this pill one time and unwanted teenage pregnancy would disappear. Oprah: Many young people in states such as Massachusetts, or California, which were among the first to adopt the Walker Treatments, may not remember what it was like back in those days. Unmarried teenage pregnancy led to many, many children growing up never knowing their fathers, raised by mothers who were young and ill-equipped to meet their needs. This was a contributing factor to the high crime rates that existed in those days, as boys, and occasionally girls, grew up without the proper 'role models' in life and drifted into criminal activity. Dr. Haywood: Yes Oprah, and some of those terrible conditions still exist in Southern cities that have resisted the treatment. [Comment elicits significant boos from one side of the studio audience]. But forgive me, you brought me on for the historical timeline and scientific expertise, I shall try to avoid politics. Oprah: Don't worry Doctor, there will be plenty of politics before this show is over, but right now we just need to get the historical record set straight. Dr. Haywood: Dr. Walker was making significant progress towards her goal of a one-time birth control pill. But clinical studies showed that there were significant side effects. She spent most of 2003 attempting to remove those side effects from the pill, but despite the fact that she is one of the greatest scientific minds of this or any other era, she was unable to do so. She finally decided that the amount of good that the drug, now called Hertozine, could bring to mankind, was more than enough to justify mass production. The side effects, for the most part, were either harmless, or in some cases actually positive. She presented her findings to her company's board, expecting that they would approve immediate production and begin FDA approval procedures. Oprah: She was wrong. Dr. Haywood: Yes. I won't bore you with the details of the company politics, but several reactionary elements within the company not only refused to give the go-ahead for production, but they also directed her to give up the research completely and begin work instead on a new diet pill that they felt could make the company millions. Oprah: Dr. Walker didn't take this sitting down? Dr. Haywood: No. Her contract with the company specifically granted her the right as senior biochemist to choose the direction that her research lab would take. These orders were a direct breach of that contract. She sued. The company realized they didn't have a leg to stand on, and they settled before it ever got to court, certainly fearful of negative publicity. Oprah: If it got out that a foolproof method of birth control was being suppressed, that company would be in a heap of trouble! Dr. Haywood: Yes, and that's why they settled. The settlement included a generous severance package for Dr. Walker, and the complete patent rights to Hertozine. Part of the settlement included agreement by Dr. Walker that she would never discuss her dealings with the company or their position on Hertozine. That's why I haven't mentioned the any company name, although a careful reading of Dr. Walker's autobiography provides some clues if you know anything about the biochemical industry. Oprah: So she went and founded WalkerChem! Dr. Haywood: Yes, and she immediately began producing and marketing Hertozine. It quickly caught on with women of all ages. By 2006, it was used by more women than any other form of birth control. Take it once, via a doctor's prescription...and you never had to fear pregnancy again. Until, a time of your choosing, when you take the reversal pill. One of the greatest advancements medical science have ever seen. Oprah: And then people learned about the side effects. Dr. Haywood: Yes. Some of the side effects were overwhelmingly positive. Hertozine's time-release regulation of the hormonal system actually eliminated most of the negative side effects of the female menstrual cycle, including cramps, PMS, and bloating. Oprah: Honey, it was too late for me but millions of women thank God for Ashley Walker and her magic pill! Dr. Haywood: The problem of course was the other major side effect. Oprah: Not everyone saw it as a problem. Dr. Haywood: No. In an era when men were commonly using Viagra to boost their sex drives, it certainly seems odd to me that a boost to the female sex drive would be such a major issue. But many people did. Oprah: It was one HECK of a boost! Dr. Haywood: Yes, a woman who had taken Hertozine saw a tremendous increase in her sexual appetite. I hate to be so blunt, but basically women were walking around horny all the time. Looking at an attractive man, or even a picture of an attractive man, or thinking about an attractive man, caused sexual arousal. Oprah: Really not all that different from the way men used to be? Dr. Haywood: No, you're exactly right. Traditionally, women would only feel real arousal from actual physical contact, foreplay if you will. Sure, a woman might feel a bit hot and bothered on occasion if she had 'gone without' for too long. But real fullscale arousal took some physical contact. A man, on the other hand, could close his eyes and think of something erotic and wind up with an erection. Basically, Hertozine made women's sexual needs just as strong, if not stronger than men's. Oprah: This had some interesting sociological effects. I'm quoting from a Stanford University study. In urban areas, where there were a lot of young professional women who made up the bulk of the early adaptors of Hertozine, business records show that women's purchases of pornographic material increased by a factor of 27! The number of men listing their occupation on their tax forms as male strippers and paid escorts skyrocketed. Many 'gentleman's clubs' which had featured nude dancing girls who gave lap dances, converted to 'ladies' clubs' with male dancers.. Dr. Haywood: WalkerChem then continued under Dr. Walker's brilliant direction, and developed vaccines for most of the major sexually transmitted diseases, including AIDs, chlamydia, and herpes. These became instant successes as well. Oprah: So women who took Hertozine and the other WalkerChem pills found that sex was virtually risk-free -- no chance of pregnancy or STDs. Dr. Haywood: And their sex drive was heightened immensely. Let me tell you from experience, it was a great time to be a young woman! Oprah: You Go Girlfriend! Dr. Haywood: But Dr. Walker had bigger dreams. Sure, her products were in use by millions of women, but not the ones who needed them most. Young teenage girls, who were most at risk for unwanted pregnancy, lacked education and means and rarely thought about birth control. Teen pregnancy and all its accompanying problems were still major issues. Dr. Walker, after some searching, found a local government in Boston to cooperate in a pilot program. All the teen girls in an impoverished section of Boston were given the opportunity to receive Hertozine for free. In fact, a system of government grants actually gave the girls an incentive to take the pill. I believe over 98% of the girls that were eligible took the offer. Over the five year period of the study, from 2008 to 2013, the improvements in that neighborhood were immense. Teen pregnancy dropped 97%. The female high school dropout rate dropped. A much higher percentage of girls not only graduated high school but went on to college. Even drug addiction rates dropped as fewer girls felt trapped in a dead-end life and resorted to crack and heroin. The study was a smashing success, and its results were on the front page of every newspaper in the nation. Many liberal members of Congress jumped on the idea of mandatory Hertozine treatment for teenage girls hitting puberty, while some opposed forcing minors to take this drug, most saw it as a public health issue, like fluoridation of water. Opponents said that it took away freedom of choice, but once a girl turned 18 she could use the reversal drug any time she wished. Few could argue that pregnancy before 18 was a valid choice for a child. By 2015, 15 states had instituted mandatory Hertozine programs for all girls reaching puberty. And the results of the Boston study were duplicated everywhere! By 2017, it was up to 25 states. Oprah: But then came the backlash. Dr. Haywood: Yes. Sexual activity in high school and even junior high jumped out of control. After all, you not only had teenage boys with raging hormones that made them want sex and think about it 24 hours a day. Now the girls were the same way. And with the elimination of the risk of pregnancy and STDs, there wasn't much reason for anyone to deny their urges. The kids were getting out of control. Oprah: The MTV documentary really hit home with a lot of parents who weren't aware of what their children were up to. Dr. Haywood: Yes. MTV sent young people into high schools, and even a few junior high schools, as undercover reporters armed with hidden cameras and microphones, to find out what life as a teen was really like. And they broadcast the results as a reality program. Oprah: It was quite shocking. Dr. Haywood: One scene that really hit home was the taped conversation in the junior high girls locker room. The 13 year old girls graphically discussing how much they needed to 'get some' and what they expected their boyfriends to do to satisfy them. Ruthless comparisons of the adequacy of various boys' body parts. And lots and lots of talk about masturbation -- what they did to satisfy themselves when a boy wasn't handy. How they did it... Oprah: And how often. Dr. Haywood: Hearing 13 year old girls talk about the fact that they would go crazy if they didn't get at least 2 or 3 orgasms a day, was just too much for some people. Fathers couldn't believe their daughters talked, and thought, like that! Oprah: Yeah, some of those same fathers probably would have been proud to hear their sons have the exact same conversation about women. A chip off the old block, boys will be boys, and so forth. Dr. Haywood: Now who's getting political, Oprah? Oprah: Sorry. So the backlash was threatening to undo all the good that Hertozine had done? Dr. Haywood: Yes, some states stopped the program, and no more new states started it. Dr. Walker realized something had to be done. She spent a year researching ways to lessen the effect that the drug had on the female libido. But she failed. Every adjustment she made to decrease libido ruined the effectiveness of the pill as birth control. It looked like this great scientific advancement, which had the potential to rid the world of unwanted pregnancy, abortion, and so many other social ills forever, was going to fail. All because of the female sex drive. Oprah: But then she had her moment of inspiration. Dr. Haywood: Yes, she was sitting in the lab taking a break, sipping some coffee with her young lab intern Melanie Jacobson, a 2nd year biochem major from MIT. Oprah: Melanie Jacobson -- she'll be an answer to a trivia question for a long, long time! Dr. Haywood: Ironically, Melanie never even went into biochemistry. She wound up changing majors, as many college kids do, and today is an aerospace engineer on the Mars Colony project. But I have a feeling she'll always be remembered for her inadvertent contribution to history during her brief time as an intern at WalkerChem! Oprah: We've all heard the story, of course, but perhaps some of our viewers in the South haven't. How did Melanie accidentally serve as the inspiration for Histromycin? Dr. Haywood: Well, Dr. Walker offhandedly said to Jacobson, "It's amazing that the only thing stopping one of the great medical advancements in history is that the female sex drive is too strong". Melanie casually replied: "Yes. Before Hertozine, men had the souped- up sex drive but women didn't, so things didn't get too out of hand because girls said no once in a while. Now both sexes have out-of- control libidos and promiscuity is rampant!" Oprah: That's when Dr. Walker had her 'aha' moment? Dr. Haywood: Yes. She had completely failed in her attempts to reduce the female sex drive side-effect while maintaining the birth control properties of the pill. She thought it was a lost cause. But Melanie's innocent comment made her realize that the increased female sex drive wasn't really the problem! The problem was that both sexes had their thermostats set on high, so to speak! Oprah: So she realized that a decrease in the male sex drive would solve the problem just as well as a decrease in the female libido. [Scattered boos from the studio audience]. Dr. Haywood: Exactly. Of course she realized that would be a hard sell. That's where she put her talents to work again. She created a drug that combined the vaccines for all the sexually transmitted diseases, as well as certain positive sexual enhancements that men -- and women -- would like. But this drug, unfortunately, also had an unavoidable side effect: it lowered the male libido. Oprah: Histromycin. [More boos]. Dr. Haywood: Histromycin had a significant lowering of the male sex drive as its primary side effect. But the important thing to remember is, it did not make men impotent. Oprah: Some men who took it thought they were at first. Dr. Haywood: Yes, the male response to non-tactile stimuli was drastically decreased. Oprah: Can you translate that for us non-scientists? Dr. Haywood: Men, and women on Hertizone, did not need much to become sexually aroused. A picture, or a glimpse of thigh, was often enough. A smell. A thought. A kiss. But men who had taken the Histromycin pill could no longer become aroused that easily. Sometimes they couldn't even arouse themselves through manual stimulation. Oprah: But yet you say they weren't impotent? Dr. Haywood: No. When with a woman (or man if they were gay), gentle stimulation by the lover could 'start their engine' so to speak. Oprah: We women always have to do all the hard work! [Laughter from the audience]. Dr. Haywood: A man who had taken Histromycin could go days or weeks or even without getting really 'horny' Sure, they would occasionally feel a little 'itch' down there, maybe even a partial erection. But they weren't perpetually horny like men had always been, and they didn't miss it that much. They could go days at a time without really even thinking about sex. Oprah: Doesn't sound like men would be running to sign up for this drug! Dr. Haywood: But in some cases they were. You see, I haven't mentioned the other effects of this drug. It increased production of certain hormones that resulted in significant enlargement of penis size. Oprah: Significant? Dr. Haywood: Yes, the average flaccid penis was 1 to 2 inches longer after the full application of Histromycin. (I should note that Histromycin, unlike Hertozine, is not actually a single pill. It's a 5- pill sequence of time-released hormones, taken 5 days apart. At the end of the 25 days the dosage is complete and the effects are irreversible) At any rate, where was I? Oh yes, a 1 to 2 inch increase in flaccid penis size and a 2 to 4 inch increase in erect length, as well as an increase in girth. And on top of that, the hormonal changes meant that when when a man has an erection a much higher percentage of the blood in the bloodstream is diverted to that organ...this means harder erections, more sensitivity for the man, and huge increases in the duration of the erection. Some men could keep it up for hours! Oprah: So the male sexual experience, not to mention his vanity, was enhanced in a big way, but at the expense of his libido. It takes a little help from a lover to start the engine, but once it gets goin' it runs like a Porsche! Dr. Haywood: That's it in a nutshell! The WalkerChem advertising, of course, emphasized the positive aspects. And parents and school administrators were getting desperate to get the kids under control. Dr. Walker went back to the same Boston neighborhood where she had done her first pilot project, and did another one. She got all the adolescent boys to take Histromycin, using financial incentives and grants. Oprah: Did they all sign up? Dr. Haywood: Well, a lot of factors were at work. A lot of parents were at wit's end. They couldn't keep their kids out of other kids beds. So many of them forced their sons to sign up. Other boys did it for the money from the grant. And once a good number had signed up, there was a certain amount of peer pressure for the others to do the same. Imagine a teenage boy who hasn't had the treatment going into the locker room full of guys whose penises had grown significantly in just 25 days, while his hadn't. Suddenly he'll feel very inadequate. There was over 95% participation in the pilot project. Oprah: The results? Dr. Haywood: Well, in a 3 year period (2018-2021), the students were carefully monitored. Sexual activity by the kids decreased to roughly the rate it had been at before Hertozine or Histromycin. Of course in general the roles were reversed -- more girls were sexually active, while more boys maintained their virginity. But the overall combined numbers were similar to the numbers from the early part of the 21st century. But there were some other significant, and unexpected results. The crime rate in that school district fell drastically. Oprah: Do we know why? Dr. Haywood: No one is 100% sure, but there are theories. Of course it's well known that young males are responsible for a very high percentage of crime in society. It's possible that some of this behavior results from the need for physical activity to help overcome sexual frustration. Or perhaps the need for money to spend on girls and dating. As girls inevitably became the sexual aggressors, they naturally started to be the ones to pay for dates, and boys didn't have the same need for cash. Another possible explanation is that as men became less aggressive and more passive sexually, they became less aggressive in other areas of their life due to chemical interactions we don't really understand. My opinion is that all of these factors combined. But regardless of the cause, the result is clear: not only did Histromycin solve the problem of rampant teenage promiscuity, it also significantly lowered crime rates. And of course one crime ? rape, became completely impossible when all the boys had taken histromycin. Oprah: I guess one would have to wonder there wasn't a corresponding rise in the number of crimes committed by females, as the roles reversed? Dr. Haywood: There was a very small increase, but the female crime rate never came close to approaching the pre-Histromycin male crime rate, perhaps because females were still physically weaker. Oprah: Or maybe we're just a bit more civilized! [Mixed reaction from the studio audience, and laughter from Dr.Haywood]. Dr. Haywood: From then on, things fell into place pretty quickly. Seeing the results of the 2nd Massachusetts study, especially the drop in crime rate, all the states that had previously begun giving adolescent girls Hertizone instituted mandatory Histromycin programs for all adolescent boys. States that had suspended their Hertizone programs resumed them, and started up Histromycin. And by 2026, 36 states had both programs in place. The other 14 states have to this day fought the program, leading to the Great Divide that affects the United States now, in 2033. Oprah: And the crime rates have gone down in all 36 states? Dr. Haywood: Yes. Let's just look at Detroit, which was one of the worst crime-plagued cities at the turn of the century. Since 2002, murder in Detroit is down 77%, robbery is down 79%, rapes are down 99.9%, the teen pregnancy rate is down 99%, and the number of abortions is down 99%. The drug problem has been more than cut in half, and neighborhoods that weren't safe to drive through 20 years ago now boast thriving school systems and family-friendly streets. Why the other 14 states still refuse, I just don't....I'm sorry Oprah, you told me to stay off politics. Oprah: Yes, we'll have plenty of that in our next segment. Dr. Haywood, thank you for coming on and providing a historical and scientific perspective for our discussion. In our next segment we will have some guests who have grown up in the Hertizone/Histromycin generation, sharing their thoughts and hopefully showing to our friends in the 14 recalcitrant states that these drugs have not created a generation of mutated perverted monsters as some of the more radical propaganda has led them to believe. [fade to commercial break as Dr. Haywood shakes hands with Oprah and leaves the set] [return from commercial break] Oprah: My next guest is 26 year old Jennifer Hollister. Jennifer grew up in New York State and was given Hertizone when she reached puberty, as were all the other girls in that state and 35 others. [Jennifer comes on stage. She is a reasonably attractive brunette, about 5'9", with medium-short length hair just a bit below the ears. She is wearing a conservative gray business suit as might have been worn by a male at the start of the 21st century, with a tie with a green and blue checked pattern on it, and grey shoes with dark socks]. Oprah: Welcome Jennifer! Jennifer: Hello Oprah, let me say it's a thrill to meet you and be on your show. I've watched you since I was a little girl and my mother watched you since she was a little girl. Oprah: Oh dear, you're making me feel all of my 80 years! [Laughter from the audience]. So tell us what you do, Jennifer. Jennifer: I was a political science major at Syracuse, and I'm currently on the staff of Congresswoman Barker (D, NY). My duties pretty much run the gamut from helping draft bills, to researching legislation, to meeting with staffmembers of other Congresspeople, preparing briefings, and so forth. Oprah: Sounds exciting. Jennifer: Yes, it is. I always wanted to go into politics. My grandfather was a New York state legislator, and I know he would be proud of me. Oprah: Now Congresswoman Barker has been somewhat middle-of-the-road on the Hertizone/Histromycin issue, hasn't she? Jennifer: Well, she opposed the legislation at the federal level that would force the recalcitrant states to begin H/H programs or face complete loss of federal interstate highway funding. She didn't feel that type of coercion was the right way to go. Oprah: But she, and you, do believe that Hertizone and Histromycin have been good for the nation? Jennifer: Oh, of course. I don't really see how any rational person can look at the crime and pregnancy statistics and not agree with that. Oprah: Well, there's quite a few people in Alabama and many other states that would disagree with you. How do you think this impasse will be resolved? What if the Southern states secede again as they did 170 years ago? Jennifer: I don't think that will happen. I think that the answer to this problem lies in economics. Oprah: Economics? Jennifer: Yes. I have an econ minor to go with my PoliSci degree, and I really think that the writing is already on the wall in that regard. As the H/H states continue to see crime rates drop, that means the cost of doing business there goes down. Do you know that the crime rate in Montgomery, Alabama, is now 7 times higher than in Baltimore? Who would have believed that 30 years ago! Just last week, Coca Cola said it was thinking of relocating its corporate offices from Atlanta to Indianapolis. Pepsi's sales have gone way up after their advertising campaign that depicted Coke drinkers as a bunch of backwards inbreds with hairy-legged men and barefoot, pregnant teenage girls. The ad campaign was lifted after a few weeks -- as it should have been, it really was offensive -- but the message got across. If more corporations move to H/H states, the recalcitrant states will fall further and further behind economically. They'll have no choice but to get with the times. [Lots of noise, both cheering and booing, from the studio audience]. Oprah: Jennifer, although you are a congressional aide, I didn't really ask you on here just to talk politics. I was hoping you could tell us a little bit about your life, and what the life of a typical girl in an H/H state is like. Yesterday I had the Reverend Falwell on. His father was a major political leader back in my day. Jennifer: Oh, Oprah, it's still your day! You're as popular as you ever were! Oprah: Well thanks for saying so. Anyway, Reverend Falwell made a lot of statements about what people were like in H/H states. I might bring this up with you and my other guests, just to get your reaction, but first, let's start with your teenage years. What was it like to be a 'Hertizone girl'. Jennifer: Well, I took my Hertizone pill when I turned 13, in 2020. New York was one of the early adopter states, so it wasn't like I was one of the first girls to take it. I guess they may have had it rough, just because they were different from the kids just a bit older than them. But for me, all the older girls ahead of me had already done it, so it was pretty commonplace by the time it was my turn. It was pretty anticlimactic...we went to the doctor's, he took a blood test to check some hormone levels, and then he determined the exact dosage and gave me the pill. I swallowed it, and went home. I didn't feel any different! Oprah: You went through adolescent with the increased sexual drive, then? Jennifer: That's how you think of it. For us girls, it was just normal. Sure, we thought about guys all the time and were always horny. I guess it was different for you, but that was all we knew. I remember when I was about twelve and a half and my friend Molly discovered a way to get around the blocking software and found some really cool porn sites on the web. Not any of that really kinky disgusting stuff, just your standard soft core stuff...great looking guys with huge throbbing rods, lying there ready to be mounted, or eager boys licking their lips and then giving great head. You know, nothing that every teenage girl hasn't drooled over on occasion. Oprah: OK, for an old-timer like me that kind of frankness is pretty unusual in a girl, but I've always been able to roll with the times. So let's talk about masturbation...if this is too embarrassing, let me know. Jennifer: No problem Oprah, it's perfectly normal. Every girl does it, whether they admit it or not. And of course the teen years are the worst...your hormones are at their peak. And don't listen to 14 year old girls bragging in the locker room -- very few of them are getting any rod, no matter what they say! The boys that age just aren't ready. Some heavy petting, maybe a good licking once in a while if you're lucky enough to find the right guy. I was a virgin until I was 16...that's 4 years after I took my H. You can do the math...I did a heck of a lot of masturbating in those 4 years, and so does every other girl. Oprah: Well, I can see we won't have any problems getting honest answers out of you! What were boys like when you were in high school? Jennifer: New York was, as I said, an early adopter state. Mandatory Histro for boys started in 2021, when I was 14. So they had a little time to adjust to it, but it was still fairly new. Things were a bit confused, socially. We girls certainly knew what we wanted...and we weren't exactly thinking with our brains, if you know what I mean! But we had been brought up as kids in the pre-H/H days. All the TV shows, videos, movies, that we watched, showed girls trying to look as pretty as possible to get the attention of boys. Dresses, makeup, all that crap. And that was how we were brought up. I played with Barbie dolls as a little girl, and wore dresses and skirts a lot. Oprah: You don't anymore? Jennifer: Very rarely. Last year I went to a wedding of an older couple, in their 30s. Pre-H/H, ya know? All the women at the wedding were wearing dresses, so I did too. When in Rome, as they say! But when I was in junior high, and even into my freshman year in high school, I actually wanted to dress that way. And makeup, pushup bra, earrings, the whole works! But gradually I just stopped doing that stuff. Oprah: Why? Jennifer: It wasn't worth the trouble. Girls used to wear that stuff so guys would notice them and 'make a move' or ask them out or whatever. Well, guys just aren't that sexual anymore. Sure, they'll probably find a girl in a dress slightly more attractive than a girl in pants, but not much more. They don't respond that way to looks, not the way we do. If a girl walked around with a shirt with a bare midriff, I'm sure the guys would notice and find her attractive. But so what, it's not like they are going to get all turned on and fired up and ask her out. Like your last guest said, visual stimuli just doesn't work on them. You gotta pump the crank to start the engine, that's what we girls always say! Now suppose a hot babe of a guy walks around with a bare midriff...well let's just say that a lot of us are going to be running into the bathroom to change our panties! And some of the things we talk about in the locker room, well I'm sure they'd make someone from your generation blush a bit. But the bottom line is that taking the trouble to put on makeup, shave your legs and armpits, or shop for pretty dresses is pretty much just wasted time. I remember my freshman year in high school I was all wet and hard for this blond who played on the boys soccer team. I used to go out and watch them practice, he'd be running around in those tight little shorts...Jesus was he hot! Well, after several weeks of getting up the nerve, I decided to stop fingering my clit and do something about it. I decided to ask him to the school dance that was coming up. So the next day I did the works...dug a pretty dress out of the back of the closet, shaved my legs, put on makeup...instead of my usual ten minute morning shower it took me a whole lickin' hour to get ready for school. I had a second period class with Soccer Boy (I can't even remember his name), and then we both had gym class 3rd period. So I figured I'd offer to walk him to gym class and ask him to the dance on the way. Foolproof plan, right? Well, of course I was still pretty inexperienced with boys and this guy was just so damn cute I could barely see straight when I was around him, and while I was walking him to class I kept fumbling for words and couldn't ask. We got to the gym. The 2nd period gym class was just finishing. Mandy McKinnon was heading to the locker room to change after they played basketball in gym that day. She was wearing a ratty old gray sweatshirt with the school name on it, complete with a hole worn through the armpit. She had her hair tied back with a rubber band. No makeup of course. A baggy pair of gym shorts. Her legs were hairy. And she had sweat dripping down her face. She came up to us, totally ignored me, said hey Seth. [Seth -- that was his name!] He said hey Mandy, what's up? And she said, "I was wondering if you wanted to go to the Autumn Dance with me?" I'm standing right there, all dolled up, and she looks like total shit. And he says yes. Talk about humiliation. That's when I decided that making myself pretty for boys was simply not worth the effort. They should make the effort for us. Oprah: What kind of effort to most boys make? Jennifer: Well, you have to realize that this was in the mid 20s. H/H was still pretty new. Just like we had been brought up on dolls and makeup and dresses, boys had been brought up wearing pants and not caring much how they looked. It was kind of a gradual thing. Some of them were pretty slow to get the message. But as high school wore on, it became obvious even to the biggest airhead of a boy, that the guys who dressed nice got asked out a lot more. If the difference between sitting home playing video games Saturday night, and having a girl take you to dinner and a movie, is just a few minor changes in wardrobe, eventually most guys are going to have some common sense and dress to get our attention. Oprah: What does that entail? Jennifer: Well, a little skin is always nice, bare midriff, or something off the shoulder. Short shorts. And of course the most interesting part of the boy is right in the middle, both front and back, if you know what I mean. If a guy's got a nice ass he has to wear something to show it off...tight jeans, or maybe bike shorts or capri pants, or something stretchy like spandex. And for God's sake, if he's hung, he certainly shouldn't wear something that's baggy in the front. Every girl can appreciate a nice looking package. Boys who are too shy to flaunt their equipment a little bit deserve to sit at home waiting for the phone that never rings. Beyond those basics, a little color is nice. Peacocks get their mates by being the most colorful, you know. Oprah: What about body hair? Jennifer: Very few guys shaved their body when I was in high school. In fact, we weren't even sure we wanted them to. That was a common argument when it came to girltalk: does a guy look better with hair or without? And opinion was pretty much split. I think everyone agreed that armpit hair is pretty gross, and when guys started wearing sleeveless stuff, most of them started shaving their pits, thank goodness. But some girls liked leg and chest hair, and some didn't. Since we weren't sure what we really liked, most boys didn't bother to make the effort. Oprah: But now, just ten years later, don't most boys shave their legs and chest, as well as their armpits? Jennifer: Yep, and the hairy ones even shave their arms. I'm not sure how it happened everywhere, but at my school, the turning point was junior year. Sarah Watson was class president, one of the most popular girls in school. And she was dating this real hottie, Vince something- or-other. About 5'10", slim, perfect ass, and hung. He used to wear these tight, rainbow colored t-shirts that didn't quite make it down to his belly button, and sexy capri pants that were skintight and went almost down to his knees. He was really popular, one of the best looking guys in school. And he was a pretty hairy guy. Sarah had been dating him for a while, and apparently she asked him to shave...she wanted to see what he would look like. Vince did. Well, he came in the next day and the results were awesome. Smooth legs, smooth trim stomach, not to mention the way he filled those capri pants. Some of the guys made fun of him, but the reaction from the female population was pretty much unanimous. After seeing Vince, every girl wanted a guy with shaved legs. I'd say within 6 months every guy in the school except for a small population of hopeless losers was shaving. Vince was the trendsetter. I don't know if that's how it happened everywhere, but that's what happened at my school. Oprah: You don't feel the least bit guilty that guys do all this shaving to impress girls, and yet most girls walk around with hairy legs and armpits? Jennifer: No, why would I? Remember, I've got that economics background. It's basically a marketplace, just like any other. If guys refused to go out with hairy girls, I'm sure we'd all start shaving. Supply and demand, ya know. But I've certainly never heard of a guy turning down a girl for that reason! Guys just aren't as picky about looks as we are. A guy wants a girl who will treat him right, make him feel special, who has a good sense of humor, who he likes to spend time with. Looks are important for them, but not quite as important. In a way, you have to hand it to guys for looking at things that way, that's good common sense. We don't have the luxury of common sense because we're thinking with our clits and not our brains all the time! Oprah: Reverend Falwell said that girls from H/H states have a secret goal of getting men to wear dresses all the time. Jennifer: That's absolutely ridiculous! I think most girls don't think a guy looks all that awesome in a dress anyway. Unless it's really tight in the front, you can't get a good view of the important stuff! Sure, it's nice to see some leg, that's a turnon, but a nice tight pair of shorts does the job much better as far as I'm concerned. Oprah: So you don't expect to see a lot of guys in dresses and skirts any time soon? Jennifer: Oprah, one thing I won't try to do is predict the whims of male fashion. It's totally beyond my comprehension how short-shorts can be all the rage one year, and lycra unitards the next year. I had a boyfriend in college who must have spent more on clothes, keeping up with the fashion trends, than he did on tuition. What's hot one month might be totally out of date the next. So I can't say for sure that they won't show up in dresses next year, but believe me there is no secret plot and I think most women wouldn't even find them that attractive. I'm just glad I'm a woman -- a nice suit like this will last me 5 or 10 years and still be in style. I might have to buy a new tie every once in a while. Oprah: What was dating like in high school? Jennifer: Basically horny girls trying to get into boys' briefs! I mean that's what it boils down to. Oprah: One thing us 'old-timers' don't understand...how come boys are reluctant to have sex? I understand their sex drive is lowered...but once they get aroused everything I've heard tells me it's an enjoyable experience for them. They don't risk pregnancy or disease. So why do they ever say no? Jennifer: Well, I'm certainly no expert in the male psyche. But you have to realize the basic difference between boys and girls: we get aroused all the time. We have urges that are too strong to ignore, we masturbate to satisfy those urges. By the time a girl is 14 or 15 she's probably got a dildo. Hell, she's probably worn one out and had to get a second one! So even when we're virgins we pretty much have an idea of what sex is going to feel like. Yeah, when you actually do it, it's so amazingly better than you ever imagined. But still, we're pretty clear on the concept before we ever mount our first rod. Now try to look at it from the boy's point of view: before he was 12, he had this tiny little rod. I guess he experienced erections and stuff, maybe he even climaxed. I don't know, 11 year old boys aren't my area of expertise! But when he's 12 and takes his Histro, everything changes. His rod gets much bigger, but he can't use it that way anymore. It just hangs there, useless. For years! Sure, sometimes when he's really excited, maybe necking with his girlfriend or something, it will tingle a bit and even start to come to attention a little. But a full fledged erection? Nope. He has no idea what that would even feel like. And to make it happen, he has to expose this most intimate part of his body to the touch of a girl. I guess that's probably a pretty scary, vulnerable feeling for a guy. We're aroused all the time, we know what to expect, but the whole concept of an erection is a big scary mystery to him. Oprah: I never thought of it that way. Jennifer: And then of course there's the physiological effects. The Histro increases the size of a boy's rod, and lets him have bigger, harder, longer lasting erections. But the way that works is by directing more blood flow to that part of his body, a lot more. As a result, the blood to the other areas of the body is diminished, especially the extremities. Basically, boys get weak in their arms and legs when they're aroused. That's why sex for a man is typically experienced lying on his back. When the blood flows to their rod, they are weak to weak to sit up half the time. That's just basic biology. Now a sexually experienced man is used to this, in fact most men love the feeling. They say the feeling of lying there, totally helpless, with their arms and legs tingling from weakness, while all their feeling is concentrated in their one ultra-sensitive organ, for up to an hour, with a girl riding it, is a great feeling for a guy. But for a virgin whose never done it, the whole concept must be pretty frightening. Letting himself go all weak and helpless like that, with a woman on top of him, you can see why a man would want to be with a woman he knows well and feels he can trust. That's why the sex act is so much more emotional for them, because they have to submit to us in a state of total helplessness. They need to feel that we care about them, and that they can trust us not to hurt them. That's why they use pretty terms like 'making love' while it's more an act of physical fulfillment for us women so we use the cruder, 4-letter word. At least that's my take on the whole thing as an amateur psychologist. Let's face it, none of us really understand men! Oprah: Well, this has been very enlightening. Let's go on to your college years. Jennifer: Are we talking about sex still, or what? Oprah: Everything. Life. What's it like to be a girl in college in an H/H state? Jennifer: Well, I was always goal-oriented, so I showed up at school prepared to work my ass off and get a 4.0 and set the world on fire. I figured I'd be in Congress by the time I was 27, and maybe President at 35 unless they amended the Constitution so I could do it sooner. But of course, college is a learning experience in more ways than just the books! Moving away from home for the first time, discovering alcohol, the usual stuff. I put on 30 pounds my freshman year. Drinking, fast food, late nite pizzas, partying. I was working on a pretty big beer- gut and my ass was a mile wide before I buckled down and started an exercise regime, running, kickboxing, free weights. I've been doing it ever since and am in pretty good shape. I wasn't getting those straight A's either but I was having a hell of a good time. You go from a high school with 500 kids -- that's 250 boys, probably two thirds of whom don't put out -- to a college with 20,000 people, and you find it's a lot easier to get laid! Co-ed dorms my freshman year, you can't beat that. Then I pledged a sorority my sophomore year, we had some major league keg parties, frat boys in thong bikinis. That was the life! All that crap old folks tell you about it being the best years of your life -- believe it! Oprah: Sounds like you had your share of boyfriends. Jennifer: Boyfriends, some of them. Others might fit into the category of one-night-stands or 'conquests'. I have to admit I was probably a bit of a jerk at times. What can I say I was an 18 year old girl! Probably no worse than most, I've matured a bit since then, I treat men better now. After a couple years of partying, I started hitting the books harder too, wound up with a pretty good grade point average and landed the congressional staffer job. What can I say, life is good. Oprah: How many people are there on Congresswoman Barker's staff? Jennifer: Hmmm...I guess I'd say 18. Oprah: How many men and how many women? Jennifer: I believe there are 4 guys on the staff. Oprah: Are they in low-level, clerical type positions? Jennifer: Two of them are, but the other two are full-fledged staffers. What are you getting at here? Oprah: Another accusation that Reverend Falwell made is that the entire WalkerChem drug suite is part of a plan by women to completely take over all forms of power in the United States and subjugate men. I have to say, when I hear those staff numbers, I must wonder if he's onto something. Jennifer: Christ, that is so ridiculous on so many levels. First of all, when that Walker woman invented the pills, she was doing it to help mankind. Secondly, this idea of some kind of conspiracy of women all across the country is absurd. I'll tell you, my boss, Congresswoman Barker, can't see eye to eye with any of the Republican women in Congress on anything, but she gets along just fine with the male Democrats. Yeah, the staff is predominately female. There's a lot of things that go into that. First of all, don't forget the migration of the late 20s. Many men moved to recalcitrant states from H/H states, especially men that were ambitious. And many women moved into H/H states from the South and other places. So the fact is, there are more females than men up here. And I don't want to over generalize, but women just naturally tend to be a little more ambitious than men. When boys in high school had their pretty little heads buried in fashion magazines, I was at Model United Nations and Young Democrats meetings. I'm sure Congresswoman Barker just got more female applicants than men. She is fully opposed to discrimination of any kind, and I really resent your implications. Oprah: OK, sorry. Reverend Falwell also said that H/H states are 'decadent socities'. Here is a picture of a bar he showed to illustrate his point. I believe it's in DC and is frequented by many congressional staffers such as yourself. Jennifer [looking at picture]: I don't know that I'd call this decadent. I see a bar with lots of people having a good time. That's O'Malley's, I think. I've been there before. Oprah: Look at the way some of the men are dressed. Jennifer: Looks pretty nice to me! Check out the package on that redhead in the green short-shorts! Oprah: Are these men other Congressional staffer? They don't dress like that for work, do they? Jennifer: Probably some of them are, others might be secretaries or receptionists. No, I doubt they dress like that for work. They probably bring a change of clothes to go out for happy hour. Oprah: And yet the women are all wearing conservative business suits. They don't change to go out after work? Jennifer: Why bother? They're the ones that are trying to attract us. Oprah: Can you at least understand how someone from a non-H/H state might find the state of affairs a bit disturbing? Jennifer: Not really. The boys in this picture look like they're having a fantastic time. Look at the smiles on their faces. Are you trying to tell me that they are somehow being treated poorly or exploited or some crap like that? Oprah: Here's another picture that Reverend Falwell says is an indication of the oppression of men. Jennifer: Bunz? Oprah: What's that? Jennifer: It's a restaurant chain. You must have heard of it, there are probably at least 3 or 4 of them here in Chicago. Oprah: I don't get out much anymore. Jennifer: They are one of the fastest growing franchise operations in America. A great business model, if you don't mind my going back to economics. The concept is pretty decent food, beer, and 18 to 22 year old waiters with great asses stuffed into skimpy costumes. They're making money hand over fist. It's an adaptation of a chain that used to exist (maybe there's a few left down south, I don't know) called Hooters, same principle, just the different sex. The waiters are called BunzBoyz. They're all great looking, and, well, you can see the uniforms, a tight cutoff t-shirt that barely gets below the nipples. An incredibly tight pair of lycra short-shorts with a thong bikini underneath. Smoothly shaved from neck to toe. They make 'em as perky and friendly as possible, they fill your drink back up for you whenever it gets low, and don't stop smiling. Women love the place, and who can blame them. And the timing was perfect. The women who started the chain rode the crest of the H/H adaptation. Whenever a state went H/H, the Hooters would usually go out of business pretty quickly. They'd buy up the property really cheap and open a Bunz. I think they're multi-millionaires now. I wish I'd thought of it! Oprah: Reverand Falwell isn't too crazy about Bunz. He says they are proof that women are trying to subjugate men. Jennifer: Subjugate? Are you kidding? Listen, most of these Bunz are located in downtown business districts. They get a lunch and happy hour crowd full of professional women. Doctors, lawyers, brokers, investment bankers, you name it. Now you've got an 18 year old boy, just out of high school, working at Bunz. Maybe he's saving up to go to college or maybe he doesn't even have the grades to go to college and he just wants a first job. It only pays minimum wage...but the tips are huge. Imagine a table with three women, let's say they're investment bankers each pulling down $200K each. They unwind after a hard day with five or six pitchers of beer and some chicken wings. The BunzBoy brings them their drinks and listens to them gripe about their day (even if he has no idea what they're talking about), nods sympathetically, never stops flashing them that perky BunzBoy smile, and always makes sure their drinks are full. And maybe every time he walks away from them he gives his butt an extra little wiggle. The tab at the end of the meal is $67. Do you think these women are going to sit there with calculators and figure out 15% and count change? Hell no, this is chump change for them. One of them's going to say it's her turn, whip a $100 out of her wallet and toss it on the table. There's a $33 tip for just one table. Multiply that by hundreds of customers a week. That boy is raking in the bucks. Now you tell me where a boy with nothing but a high school education can make that kind of money! And yet you want to say they are being subjugated? Give me a break! Oprah: I notice that it looks like the BunzBoy in that picture is wearing makeup. Like I said, I don't get out much, but I'm told that boys wearing makeup is a very recent development. Jennifer: There's a story there too, another shrewd business story. When the H/H trend hit, girls like me quickly realized that wearing makeup was a waste of our time. Who wants to spend time putting goop all over your face? Makeup sales took a major nosedive, at least in the 36 H/H states. Several companies that had been in business for decades went belly up. But Revlon saw the writing on the wall, and they got proactive, as they say in the business community. Here's what they did: they realized that it was too soon to start marketing makeup for men, the market wasn't there and too many men still had hangups based on how they were brought up. But they could see down the road a few years. Eventually those hangups would go away. So they eased into the market sideways. They took one of their basic brands of makeup, I think it's called base? It matches your skin tone. Different shades for different skin tones, both for whites and African-Americans. They marketed it to guys in high school as acne coverup cream. They marketed it heavily everywhere, even in the south they manage to get guys using it. Getting an endorsement from that Heisman winning quarterback from Georgia was pure genius. Pretty soon, 95% of the boys in H/H states, and at least half the boys everywhere else, were covering up their zits with this stuff. And Revlon had the market cornered, none of the other companies thought about it. But the most important thing was the habits they formed. It became second nature for guys to spend a little extra time in the morning putting this stuff on their faces. Boys would carry a tube of it in their fanny pack or back pack (they hadn't really started carrying purses yet back then), and they'd run into the men's room between classes to see if they needed a touchup. In the evening, they'd use a cold cream with moisturizer to get the goop off their faces. (It was actually the same cold cream that women had used for years, but it was marketed to boys with some bullshit about having the right pH balance for male skin). After a few years, no self-respecting teenage boy would go out in public without standing in front of a mirror and putting on his acne coverup in the morning. And all day long, whenever a mirror presented itself, he'd check to see if he needed a touchup. Once that habit was ingrained, it was just a matter of time before men started looking at other products to make their faces more attractive for us. Revlon bided their time, and finally came out with a rouge to brighten men's cheeks, and then a shiny lip gloss. They were slow to gain acceptance at first, but like everything else, once an attractive, popular guy wore it the fashion took off. Men follow fashion like sheep. I thought it might end there but I've been seeing more and more bright lipstick on guys lately. It certainly helps you notice them - - it's that peacock thing again. Kind of a pain to get a guy's lipstick all over your mouth when you kiss him, but I'm sure we'll get used to it. So far that's all I've seen...no mascara or anything else to do with the eyes. But like I've told you before, male fashion is a big mystery to me. Things could be totally different in just a few months. Oprah: Well Jennifer, I appreciate the time you've spent with us. This has been very enlightening for us all. We've learned a lot about what it's like to be a woman in an H/H state. Now it's time to get the male point of view. Jennifer, if you could just slide over one chair to make room for our new guest. Believe it or not, we have an actual BunzBoy here to talk about that controversial and popular restaurant chain. I'd like you to welcome Clint Thompson! [Clint is about 5'11", with blond hair that just brushes the top of his shoulders, extremely slender but not bony. He is attired in typical BunzBoy uniform, a tight half-shirt with the restaurant logo, and a neon yellow pair of lycra short-shorts that leave little to the imagination, smoothly shaved legs, with white socklets and white tennis shoes] Oprah: Welcome to the show Clint! Clint: Hello Oprah, it's nice to meet you. Oprah: Clint, I understand that you are not just a run of the mill BunzBoy. Clint: No, I was one of twelve boys nationwide selected to pose in the BunzBoy swimsuit calendar. I'm Mr. February. Oprah: Do you have the calendar with you? Clint: Yes, here it is. [Holds up to camera. Clint is lying on his side, wearing a skimpy blue Speedo bikini, on a sandy beach. He is extremely well-endowed, as his rod seems to be stretching the Speedo to the limits of its capacity. His smooth hairless body glistens, and his head is leaning on his hand. He's got a big smile, with red lipstick, and his blond hair is hanging down and partially obscuring his face. The only other article of clothing is a belly-button ring. There is some appreciative female applause from the crowd] Oprah: Well, it looks like you're quite popular with the women in our audience. How were you selected to be on the calendar? Clint: My manager nominated me as the representative for her restaurant. We took some photos and sent them in, and I was chosen! Oprah: You're not waiting tables at Bunz now, are you? Clint: No, I'm on a promotional tour for the calendar. We go to Bunz all across the country and autograph calendars. It's a lot of fun! Oprah: What happens when the promotional tour is over? Clint: I'll probably go back to Bunz, unless someone notices me and gives me a chance to break into modeling. Oprah: What are your long term career goals? Clint: Well, BunzBoyz aren't allowed to work past 23, they want to keep bringing in young blood. I'm 19 now, so that's a long way away. Oprah: Clint, I have to ask...do you feel like you are exploited by this job? Clint: Of course not, that's just silly! I can't imagine I could have found a job that pays better, and then I got the calendar opportunity. This is more than I could have dreamed of! Oprah: You've certainly got a terrific smile! Clint: [blushing a little] Thanks! I can't believe I'm here on your show. Oprah: Tell us a little bit about how the customers treat you. Do you get propositioned a lot? Clint: Well of course women are going to ask me out! There's nothing wrong with that! If I went an entire shift without that happening I'd worry there was something wrong with me. Oprah: Have you ever dated a customer? Clint: Yes, but I really don't want to talk about my personal life on the air. Oprah: I'm sorry. I've heard that the women at Bunz can sometimes get a little grabby. Clint: Well, I guess it just kinda goes with the job. These outfits are pretty skimpy, and they're women. You can't really blame them. I get my butt pinched a lot. Sometimes it's a little red and sore at the end of the night from all the pinching. I'm used to it. It's when they try to touch me in the front that I really don't like it. A lot of women think because we work at Bunz that we're sluts or tramps. That's just not true. There's nothing wrong with having a nice body and being proud of it and showing it off a little. I spend hours and hours doing aerobics and counting every calorie. Some women assume that every guy at Bunz is easy, but we aren't. Sure, some are. But I had a friend that I worked with last year, and he was 21 and he was still a virgin. Oprah: What age range of women do you get in Bunz? Clint: It depends on the time. At lunchtime on weekdays, it's mostly businesswomen, in their 20s or 30s or even 40s. Happy hour is mostly a 20-something crowd. Weekends you can have anything. I used to work in the Boston Bunz, near the Common, and the Women's Rugby League used to have their games nearby and the teams often came in right afterwards to drink beer. They got so rowdy! Sometimes you'll see high school girls too, we can't serve them alcohol but they can still get cokes and food. Sometimes families, too. Oprah: Families? Does that include men and boys? Clint: Sure. I know that people think the rule is no men or boys, but that's not what it really is. It's just that you can't have an all-male party. Men and boys have to be an a party with at least one female. It's because management was afraid we would become a gay bar, I think. Not that they have anything against gays, but that wasn't the group they were targeting. But sometimes there will be a family, a Dad and Mom and kids. If little boys come in we have these cute little BunzBoyz uniforms we can sell them. Oprah: What customers do you like the most? Clint: Businesswomen tip the most. But college girls are the most fun, they just want to get drunk and they're like more my age so they're interesting to talk to. I think the worst are 12 to 14 year old girls. They are just so full of themselves and all they think or talk about is sex and they think it's just so cool to say stuff like, 'Hey baby-doll, can I stroke your rod'. And they get as grabby as the older women too. Maybe worse. Oprah: If you had a little brother, how would you feel about him following in your footsteps and become a BunzBoy? Clint: I do, his name's Bobby. [flashes big smile at camera and waves] Hi Bobby! Bobby's 13 and he does want to be a BunzBoy. Sure, I'd worry about him. I mean now he's all kind of young and naive and doesn't understand women that well. There are some real sharks out there. My best friend from high school came to work at Bunz and he started to date the first customer that asked him. She was really old, like 29, and he didn't know it but she was married and didn't tell him. She even